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Orange Marmalade on Toast EIPA


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#1 Steve Urquell

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 03:27 PM

I haven't brewed an ale in years now. I had a St. Peter's EIPA https://www.ratebeer...pale-ale/62444/ awhile back and it really got me wanting to brew one again. It's listed as having "Suffolk malt and First Gold hops" From what I can find, Suffolk malt is Munton's. I have no experience with Munton's other than as some stale ale malt my LHBS sold me years ago. Anyways, I'm not looking for a direct clone, just the general flavor I listed as the thread title. How's this looking? 7gal batch. 1.060OG, 1.015FG, 55IBUs London ale yeast--my buddy's drauflassen harvest 13lb Avangard German Munich 7L 8oz British Caramalt (Fawcett) 8-12L 2.3ozs Amarillo 60min 1oz First Gold 10min 2oz First Gold 175F whirlpool 1.5oz First Gold Dry hop

#2 johnpreuss

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 03:57 PM

I don't think you're going to get there with that malt.... malty not toasty.  I'd see if you can get some Marris Otter.  I bet the hops get you there on that side.

 

Wow... I bet you don't remember how to ferment above 55dF!!! 



#3 Steve Urquell

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 04:47 PM

I don't think you're going to get there with that malt.... malty not toasty.  I'd see if you can get some Marris Otter.  I bet the hops get you there on that side.   Wow... I bet you don't remember how to ferment above 55dF!!!

I was wondering about the toast. I figured the 6L would have a little. I haven't done an all Munich batch before though. Will yeast ferment above 55F?

#4 neddles

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 07:12 PM

My tastes gravitate toward John's Maris Otter recommendation. However, I am not familiar with the Munich malt you have listed. I get a nice toasty flavor from light amounts of Fawcett pale chocolate, about 3-4oz in 6 gallons. Maybe mix that with a similar quantity of victory/biscuit layered on top of bready MO? Just thinking out loud here 'cause it's fun.

 

I have used First Gold and it is a nice UK hop for sure. Its EKG like but it does have a bit of a orange flavor, just orangey in a UK hop kind of way, not anything like the orangey you get from American hops like a Columbus, Amarillo, or El Dorado. If you like EKG you'll probably like First Gold.



#5 Steve Urquell

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Posted 09 March 2015 - 04:25 AM

I don't think you're going to get there with that malt.... malty not toasty.  I'd see if you can get some Marris Otter.  I bet the hops get you there on that side.
 
Wow... I bet you don't remember how to ferment above 55dF!!!

 

My tastes gravitate toward John's Maris Otter recommendation. However, I am not familiar with the Munich malt you have listed. I get a nice toasty flavor from light amounts of Fawcett pale chocolate, about 3-4oz in 6 gallons. Maybe mix that with a similar quantity of victory/biscuit layered on top of bready MO? Just thinking out loud here 'cause it's fun.
 
I have used First Gold and it is a nice UK hop for sure. Its EKG like but it does have a bit of a orange flavor, just orangey in a UK hop kind of way, not anything like the orangey you get from American hops like a Columbus, Amarillo, or El Dorado. If you like EKG you'll probably like First Gold.

Hmm, you guys have me wondering now. I may have over-emphasized the toasty aspect of this beer. It's more like orange marmalade on warm fluffy biscuit. Slightly toasty with more sweetness than I get from Maris. More sweet/malty than toasty.

I originally was going to use Golden Promise. May go that way thanks to your suggestions.

Edited by chils, 09 March 2015 - 04:25 AM.


#6 Big Nake

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Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:57 AM

Look! Chils is using Amarillo as a bittering hop! :o  :lol:

 

Personally Chils, I would also get some English base malt for this.  I have an ESB going right now where I used Rahr Pale Ale malt which is not really to style but it *IS* a pale ale malt and I always have a sack of it.  If I'm not making some German & Czech (or American...) styles, I'm making something English and I like the idea of using the proper ingredients.  I really like some of the English specialty malts (especially Fawcett), English hops and especially English yeast.  If your buddy has a 1028 Drauflassen slurry, it should be pip-pip cheerio.  Oh, disregard that last part.  <_<


Edited by Village Taphouse, 09 March 2015 - 06:01 AM.


#7 Steve Urquell

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Posted 09 March 2015 - 05:00 PM

Look! Chils is using Amarillo as a bittering hop! :o  :lol:   Personally Chils, I would also get some English base malt for this.  I have an ESB going right now where I used Rahr Pale Ale malt which is not really to style but it *IS* a pale ale malt and I always have a sack of it.  If I'm not making some German & Czech (or American...) styles, I'm making something English and I like the idea of using the proper ingredients.  I really like some of the English specialty malts (especially Fawcett), English hops and especially English yeast.  If your buddy has a 1028 Drauflassen slurry, it should be pip-pip cheerio.  Oh, disregard that last part.  <_<

Yeah, def going with Golden Promise on this one. Those Amarillo are some 2011 stuff that wasn't great in 2012. Just not a good batch/harvest I guess.

#8 Steve Urquell

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 07:41 AM

Brewed this one today starting at 0500. Almost done chilling now. 7 gallon batch. These Saphir hops have a nice floral aroma and are very mild. Character is like Amarillo meets Hallertau. Thought they'd meld well in this beer. Recipe looks like:   10lb Golden Promise 4lb Floor malted BoPils 8oz British Crystal 45 6oz Victory   1.5oz Amarillo 60min 2oz First Gold 10min 2oz First Gold 175F 1.5oz Saphir 175F Dry Hop will be 2oz First Gold, 1.5oz Saphir Mash: 145F 30min/158F 30min 75ppm each SO4 and CaCl2 Mangrove Jack's M07 dry British ale drauflassen'd until it starts in 1 gallon on stirplate then pitched to main batch, 66F ferment

#9 neddles

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:23 AM

Ill bet this will be really nice. I have had some thoughts about a similar EIPA for summer…. one including MO, light british crystal and a touch of victory. First Gold and Willamette. WLP002 or WY1469. Brewing a lighter English Summer Ale today so maybe later in the summer. Keep us updated.



#10 Steve Urquell

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:31 AM

Ill bet this will be really nice. I have had some thoughts about a similar EIPA for summer…. one including MO, light british crystal and a touch of victory. First Gold and Willamette. WLP002 or WY1469. Brewing a lighter English Summer Ale today so maybe later in the summer. Keep us updated.

Will do. I forgot to add that I ended up with 3qts too much of second runnings. Boiled it down to ~ 3/4 cup on the stovetop and added it back at the end. It tasted like pure toffee. First time using First Gold hops too. I smashed a few pellets to smell. They seem very similar to EKG to me.

#11 neddles

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:34 AM

Will do. I forgot to add that I ended up with 3qts too much of second runnings. Boiled it down to ~ 3/4 cup on the stovetop and added it back at the end. It tasted like pure toffee. First time using First Gold hops too. I smashed a few pellets to smell. They seem very similar to EKG to me.

I used them once and liked them. Yes, most similar to EKG I'd say... maybe a little more orangey and less floral for lack of better descriptors.



#12 Steve Urquell

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Posted 16 June 2015 - 09:41 AM

I used them once and liked them. Yes, most similar to EKG I'd say... maybe a little more orangey and less floral for lack of better descriptors.

Good to hear. I didn't know if I was going to get the orange I wanted in this beer.

#13 Steve Urquell

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Posted 17 June 2015 - 07:03 PM

Wow these non lager, how do you call them, ail (sp?) yeasts really go apeshit. The Mangrove yeasts have a rep for low cell count and slow starts. My drauflassen starter was at high krausen on the plate after 6 hrs. Racked the main batch off the trub and pitched it. It had pressure 4hrs later. Today its going like a turbo vette at 65F. Drauflassen on the stirplate with a later pitch the same day is a good strategy for ales w/o having to worry about unpitched wort sitting overnight.

#14 MyaCullen

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Posted 17 June 2015 - 08:15 PM

Wow these non lager, how do you call them, ail (sp?) yeasts really go apeshit. The Mangrove yeasts have a rep for low cell count and slow starts. My drauflassen starter was at high krausen on the plate after 6 hrs. Racked the main batch off the trub and pitched it. It had pressure 4hrs later. Today its going like a turbo vette at 65F. Drauflassen on the stirplate with a later pitch the same day is a good strategy for ales w/o having to worry about unpitched wort sitting overnight.

I have only used M07 myself, and it is not, in my experience (n=4) a slow starter, fast starter, good profiles, good floccer.



#15 Steve Urquell

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 03:52 AM

I have only used M07 myself, and it is not, in my experience (n=4) a slow starter, fast starter, good profiles, good floccer.

There are a few threads on HBT about the slow starting stuff and my experience w/ M84 lager yeast was one of them. 2 packs Wouldn't start at 50F at all, after several days raised to 57F and took ~40hrs to start after that. Someone contacted Mangrove CS and they said that their packs contain from 50b to 200b cells. I assume 50b when using them. How was the flavor profile from this yeast in your batch?

#16 MyaCullen

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 07:06 AM

There are a few threads on HBT about the slow starting stuff and my experience w/ M84 lager yeast was one of them. 2 packs Wouldn't start at 50F at all, after several days raised to 57F and took ~40hrs to start after that. Someone contacted Mangrove CS and they said that their packs contain from 50b to 200b cells. I assume 50b when using them. How was the flavor profile from this yeast in your batch?

malty, bready, a little minerally, very typically British, a bit drier than you get from 1968/002

 

I just checked the date on the pack I used, it's 9 months out of date  :shock: but it took off fine and finished where it was supposed too.



#17 Steve Urquell

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 03:48 PM

malty, bready, a little minerally, very typically British, a bit drier than you get from 1968/002   I just checked the date on the pack I used, it's 9 months out of date  :shock: but it took off fine and finished where it was supposed too.

Good to hear. This yeast has mixed reviews. I read "too dry" on many and got a little skeered.

#18 MyaCullen

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 04:38 PM

Good to hear. This yeast has mixed reviews. I read "too dry" on many and got a little skeered.

it makes excellent dry stout




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