44 replies to this topic

[HVB]

So, what is your take?  I know some have no preference and some like them clear.  I fall in the clear camp but just because I feel we drink with our eyes first and what we see will impart a perception with what we drink.  My last hoppy beer I did not follow my normal process and just went from dry hops to a keg with no fining.  I did let it crash to the ambient of the room , 50*.  I actually let it crash twice, once before the dry hop and once after.  The beer is cloudy, no hop particles or what not just cloudy but tastes great and has a mouth-feel that I really like.  This was done with S-05 and that is not known to be a great flocculater but I am still not 100% convinced it is yeast that is making it cloudy, I think it is more related to the amount of dry hops.  I plan to brew the same beer again soon and try a different yeast, M-07, and see how that impacts the beer.  I plan to do the same process but I will be splitting the batch and do one with bio-fine.  In the past I have not felt bio-fine has stripped anything away from the beer.

 

TL/DR - I am sure I obsess too much over the clarity of my hoppy beers.

[positiveContact]

I agree clear looks nicer but if cloudy tastes better taste wins out.  Both would obviously be ideal.

 

I'll have another data point soon but I think the answer is to dry hop after the beer is clear.  This might mean waiting a while before dry hopping or gelling the beer to get the yeast to drop out quickly prior to dry hopping.

[matt6150]

I've never really obsessed about clear IPA's. As long as it's good and hop particles floating around it is fine by me. That said I picked up some bio-fine and I plan on doing a split batch with the Chinook/Citra Pale with one getting bio-fine at kegging. Just to see what the difference would be. What would you suggest for amount of the bio-fine?

[HVB]

I've never really obsessed about clear IPA's. As long as it's good and hop particles floating around it is fine by me. That said I picked up some bio-fine and I plan on doing a split batch with the Chinook/Citra Pale with one getting bio-fine at kegging. Just to see what the difference would be. What would you suggest for amount of the bio-fine?

I use 1-2 tablespoons for hoppy beers and it is good in 1-2 days.

[Howie]

Reasonably clear.A little haze is fine, but shouldn't be cloudy or chunky. Super cloudy beer means there is something in suspension. Some of that may be extra hops, but to me when beer is that cloudy there are usually other underlying flavors that keep the beer from tasting clean.

[positiveContact]

Reasonably clear.A little haze is fine, but shouldn't be cloudy or chunky. Super cloudy beer means there is something in suspension. Some of that may be extra hops, but to me when beer is that cloudy there are usually other underlying flavors that keep the beer from tasting clean.

 

if there are too many hop chunks it actually makes it taste overly bitter to me so I do like to avoid that.

[HVB]

if there are too many hop chunks it actually makes it taste overly bitter to me so I do like to avoid that.

Agree with that.  I do not like chunks in my beer.

[SchwanzBrewer]

Should never be muddy, but hazy is fine. It's supposed to be good to clear the beer prior to dry hopping so that the protein haze doesn't bind the volatiles from the hops and drop out of solution when it's chilled. This in combination with reports that dry hopping works best at 70 degrees would mean that you cold crash, fine, clear, warm up, dry hop, and cold crash again. That seems like a pain in the ass.

[HVB]

Should never be muddy, but hazy is fine. It's supposed to be good to clear the beer prior to dry hopping so that the protein haze doesn't bind the volatiles from the hops and drop out of solution when it's chilled. This in combination with reports that dry hopping works best at 70 degrees would mean that you cold crash, fine, clear, warm up, dry hop, and cold crash again. That seems like a pain in the ass.

That is what I did on my last beer.  Granted, the cold crashes could have been colder.

 

My feeling on the commercial breweries putting out this beer is they are trying to turn it around so fast they are not letting it crash at all.

[SchwanzBrewer]

That is what I did on my last beer.  Granted, the cold crashes could have been colder.

 

My feeling on the commercial breweries putting out this beer is they are trying to turn it around so fast they are not letting it crash at all.

 

I thought so too. Coppertail dry hops freedive IPA in the fermenter then moves it to a brite tank. They have the benefit of dumping the trub before dry hopping. I guess you could secondary and dry hop, but that would be annoying as well.

[neddles]

I've said it before, I don't mind a hazy/cloudy IPA. Taste comes first. I know people say you drink the beer first with your eyes. I agree, and at this point I associate hazy IPA with fresh IPA. I don't mind the beer reflecting the process in the product.  Chunks or visible particulate is not acceptable. Hop and yeast driven beers are just fine with haze. Don't even think about giving me cloudy lager or really any other malt driven beer that I can think of off hand.

 

I have been happy with my dry hopped beers ~90% of the time. I would like to nail down one process that pleased me every time but instead I have tried several ways of doing it (timing/crashing/technique/temperature) and they still come perfectly good almost every time. I think that why it has been hard to nail a best process. Also, hops being an agricultural product, we are going to be subject to some variability from bag to bag and year to year. And I wonder if sometimes the best practice might depend on the batch of hops you are working with. 

[SchwanzBrewer]

I've said it before, I don't mind a hazy/cloudy IPA. Taste comes first. I know people say you drink the beer first with your eyes. I agree, and at this point I associate hazy IPA with fresh IPA. I don't mind the beer reflecting the process in the product.  Chunks or visible particulate is not acceptable. Hop and yeast driven beers are just fine with haze. Don't even think about giving me cloudy lager or really any other malt driven beer that I can think of off hand.

 

I have been happy with my dry hopped beers ~90% of the time. I would like to nail down one process that pleased me every time but instead I have tried several ways of doing it (timing/crashing/technique/temperature) and they still come perfectly good almost every time. I think that why it has been hard to nail a best process. Also, hops being an agricultural product, we are going to be subject to some variability from bag to bag and year to year. And I wonder if sometimes the best practice might depend on the batch of hops you are working with. 

 

More so the amount I would think.

[positiveContact]

I alluded to this earlier but I have one data point which is drez's Chinook/citra/simcoe pale ale.  my first keg was dry hopped right away while there was still some yeast in suspension.  aroma was good and all of that.  keg number 2 was dry hopped long after it had cleared.  the hop aroma seems more intense and cleaner.  both were dry hopped cold.

 

pretty soon I'll get to try this again with my pliny clone.  keg one is almost complete.

[neddles]

I alluded to this earlier but I have one data point which is drez's Chinook/citra/simcoe pale ale.  my first keg was dry hopped right away while there was still some yeast in suspension.  aroma was good and all of that.  keg number 2 was dry hopped long after it had cleared.  the hop aroma seems more intense and cleaner.  both were dry hopped cold.

 

pretty soon I'll get to try this again with my pliny clone.  keg one is almost complete.

Lemme pry a little about the process. So keg number 2 got dry hops while in the keg? How long, or did you leave them in there indefinitely? How long after legging did you dry hop it and was it cold all that time? was it cold for the duration of the dry hopping?

Edited by nettles, 08 April 2015 - 11:31 AM.

[positiveContact]

Lemme pry a little about the process. So keg number 2 got dry hops while in the keg? How long, or did you leave them in there indefinitely? How long after legging did you dry hop it and was it cold all that time? was it cold for the duration of the dry hopping?

 

full disclosure on the process.  all 10 gallons was dry hopped towards the end of ferment for about 6 days I think.  this involved warm temps followed by cold temps when it was time to keg.

 

when I went to keg the beer was cold.  5 gallons went into a keg with hops in it.  5 gallons went into a keg with no hops.  both kegs stayed (or continue to stay) cold from that point forward.  the dry hopped keg had the hops in there until it kicked.  once this happened I started dry hopping keg #2.  keg #2 will have the hops in it until it kicks.  I feel that 2 had a cleaner, more intense hop aroma.

 

I'm thinking from now on I may skip fermenter dry hopping for most beers.  it's awesome for a few weeks but then it really dies down.  I think as much as possible I'll try to dry hop beer that is mostly or completely clear.

[HVB]

full disclosure on the process.  all 10 gallons was dry hopped towards the end of ferment for about 6 days I think.  this involved warm temps followed by cold temps when it was time to keg.

 

when I went to keg the beer was cold.  5 gallons went into a keg with hops in it.  5 gallons went into a keg with no hops.  both kegs stayed (or continue to stay) cold from that point forward.  the dry hopped keg had the hops in there until it kicked.  once this happened I started dry hopping keg #2.  keg #2 will have the hops in it until it kicks.  I feel that 2 had a cleaner, more intense hop aroma.

 

I'm thinking from now on I may skip fermenter dry hopping for most beers.  it's awesome for a few weeks but then it really dies down.  I think as much as possible I'll try to dry hop beer that is mostly or completely clear.

So what will you do?  Keg and crash and then just hop in the keg?

[positiveContact]

So what will you do?  Keg and crash and then just hop in the keg?

 

I already crash before kegging.  I'm thinking I'll just give it more time before I go to keg.  it won't be perfect but it will be better.

 

as much as I enjoy the effect of dry hopping towards the end of fermentation it's really hard to justify it unless I know the beer will get consumed in less than a few weeks.  after that those hops seem to really fade fast.  this is all at my house though.  it seems that everyone has slightly different experiences with their own slightly different process.

[neddles]

full disclosure on the process.  all 10 gallons was dry hopped towards the end of ferment for about 6 days I think.  this involved warm temps followed by cold temps when it was time to keg.

 

when I went to keg the beer was cold.  5 gallons went into a keg with hops in it.  5 gallons went into a keg with no hops.  both kegs stayed (or continue to stay) cold from that point forward.  the dry hopped keg had the hops in there until it kicked.  once this happened I started dry hopping keg #2.  keg #2 will have the hops in it until it kicks.  I feel that 2 had a cleaner, more intense hop aroma.

 

I'm thinking from now on I may skip fermenter dry hopping for most beers.  it's awesome for a few weeks but then it really dies down.  I think as much as possible I'll try to dry hop beer that is mostly or completely clear.

Thanks for this. I have for a while now done the first dry hop as you did and then crash for 24 hrs and keg with dry hops. Most recently I let the carboy (primary) sit in the fridge for about 5 days and then racked onto dry hops cold and put back into the cold. It's only been about 3 days on the hops so they are a bit harsh yet but showing signs that I am going to get a really nice character from them.

[HVB]

I already crash before kegging.  I'm thinking I'll just give it more time before I go to keg.  it won't be perfect but it will be better.

 

as much as I enjoy the effect of dry hopping towards the end of fermentation it's really hard to justify it unless I know the beer will get consumed in less than a few weeks.  after that those hops seem to really fade fast.  this is all at my house though.  it seems that everyone has slightly different experiences with their own slightly different process.

 

I think the part in bold part is highly dependent on what hop it is.  I have an IPA I put on tap Feb 4 that still has a great nose.  Now this did get a LOT of hops though, 2 charges of over 4oz each time.  Once in the primary and once in the brite tank before going to the serving tank.

 

ETA: I try to dry hop for 4-5 days only.  And I do not keg dry hop.

Edited by drez77, 08 April 2015 - 11:45 AM.

[positiveContact]

I think the part in bold part is highly dependent on what hop it is.  I have an IPA I put on tap Feb 4 that still has a great nose.  Now this did get a LOT of hops though, 2 charges of over 4oz each time.  Once in the primary and once in the brite tank before going to the serving tank.

 

ETA: I try to dry hop for 4-5 days only.  And I do not keg dry hop.

 

good points - I don't have a lot of hop samples.  both beers I'm working with have a lot of simcoe dry hops in the keg.