93 replies to this topic

[HVB]

I have done both 90 and 60 minute boil times for beers I use a majority of Pils malt in and to be honest I have not noticed a difference in the final product.  Is there really any benefit to doing a 90 minute boil?  When you add that and a long whrilpool it can make for a long day.

[positiveContact]

I've always been too nervous to test it.  I think the highest I've gone is something like 30% pils with a 60 min boil.  all of my mostly pils beers have been 90 min boils.

[neddles]

I've always been too nervous to test it.  I think the highest I've gone is something like 30% pils with a 60 min boil.  all of my mostly pils beers have been 90 min boils.

Same. But I would *guess* in a hoppy beer with a vigorous 60 min. boil your never going to taste the difference.

[HVB]

I've always been too nervous to test it.  I think the highest I've gone is something like 30% pils with a 60 min boil.  all of my mostly pils beers have been 90 min boils.

I have done the my standard APA grain bill at 60 before with no real issues.  I guess if it was a Helles or something of that nature I can see noticing any off flavor more.

[3rd party JKor]

I'd have to look back in my notes, but I think I've done a full pils boil at 60 mins.  If you get below the DMS formation temp quickly, I don't think it really matters.  Large commercial brewers often have the wort at high temp for a while before cooling, which is probably what drives the 90 min boil recommendation.

[Bklmt2000]

Weyermann Pils has my main base malt for several years, and I've done both 60- and 90-min boils.  Never detected DMS either way.

 

I generally stick with 90-min boils these days, as doing a 90-min boil allows me to collect more wort and get a lilttle better effiency vs. a 60-min boil.

[HVB]

So would a 60 minute boil and a 30 minute whirlpool accomplish the same as a 90 minute boil?

[3rd party JKor]

Well, the theory is that DMS collects in the wort if it's above ~175 (SMM converts to DMS) and it's not boiling.  The boiling action allows the DMS to escape, although whirlpooling might be enough turn over of the liquid to accomplish the same thing.

 

What temp do you whirlpool at?

[Bklmt2000]

So would a 60 minute boil and a 30 minute whirlpool accomplish the same as a 90 minute boil?

 

I'd say probably not, since the 30-min whirlpool would probably be at sub-boiling temps.

 

Just an educated guess.

[neddles]

Well, the theory is that DMS collects in the wort if it's above ~175 (SMM converts to DMS) and it's not boiling.  The boiling action allows the DMS to escape, although whirlpooling might be enough turn over of the liquid to accomplish the same thing.

 

What temp do you whirlpool at?

 

IF the 175F lower limit is correct then whirlpool at 160-165F. No SMM, no surprise IBUs, less hop oil volatilization. Win.

[HVB]

Well, the theory is that DMS collects in the wort if it's above ~175 (SMM converts to DMS) and it's not boiling.  The boiling action allows the DMS to escape, although whirlpooling might be enough turn over of the liquid to accomplish the same thing.

 

What temp do you whirlpool at?

175-180

Edited by drez77, 15 July 2015 - 12:57 PM.

[3rd party JKor]

IF the 175F lower limit is correct then whirlpool at 160-165F. No SMM, no surprise IBUs, less hop oil volatilization. Win.

 

 

Well, these things aren't really 'limits', but that's the typically quoted threshold for reducing DMS below detectable levels.

 

Seems like a good idea to WP at 165 for a pils heavy beer.

[Big Nake]

I always boil for ~60 minutes. Always. A helles with mostly pils and then small amounts of Vienna, light Munich, etc. gets a 60-minute boil. Not sure if I have done a long whirlpool or hopstand on a beer like this but I haven't noticed DMS in any of my light styles where pils is used. That said, I remember seeing/reading/hearing that if you get your pils wort from boiling down to 140° as quickly as possible (2-3 minutes?), it would reduce your chance or seeing DMS in the beer. So that suggests that a long whirlpool could be an issue. I'm completely spitballing here so take NOTHING that I say seriously.

[positiveContact]

I always boil for ~60 minutes. Always. A helles with mostly pils and then small amounts of Vienna, light Munich, etc. gets a 60-minute boil. Not sure if I have done a long whirlpool or hopstand on a beer like this but I haven't noticed DMS in any of my light styles where pils is used. That said, I remember seeing/reading/hearing that if you get your pils wort from boiling down to 140° as quickly as possible (2-3 minutes?), it would reduce your chance or seeing DMS in the beer. So that suggests that a long whirlpool could be an issue. I'm completely spitballing here so take NOTHING that I say seriously.

 

I always saw the temp cut off as 170-190F or something like that.  how long does it take you to chill your wort?

[Big Nake]

I always saw the temp cut off as 170-190F or something like that.  how long does it take you to chill your wort?

That depends on the season. Quick in the winter... like <5 minutes from boiling down to maybe 60° (with constant stirring) and over 10 minutes in the summer to make it down to 70° or so. The kettle ends up in the sink with ice (more ice for lagers, less for ales) after the IC does its work. Either way though... I can make it from 212 to 140 in 2-3 minutes.

[djinkc]

I used to boil for 90 with pils.  This was CMC pilsner malt almost exclusively.  I quite doing it for DMS reduction since I tasted no difference 60 vs. 90.  The last 1056 Alt I made had a 60 min boil.  While not being ready yet it didn't have DMS that I could detect.

[Big Nake]

I used to boil for 90 with pils.  This was CMC pilsner malt almost exclusively.  I quite doing it for DMS reduction since I tasted no difference 60 vs. 90.  The last 1056 Alt I made had a 60 min boil.  While not being ready yet it didn't have DMS that I could detect.

I have always been a little squeamish about DMS (a vegetal, cooked-corn flavor and/or aroma) because it just sounds so terribly nasty. I wonder if something has changed in homebrewing or with pils malt or whatever... because years ago people would be religiously boiling a pils-based wort for 90-minutes without exception. How could so many people conclude that 60 vs 90 makes no difference and not experience DMS?

[Steve Urquell]

I've used pils as base for years now. I've gone thru several bags of Rahr, Weyermann, and Best Malz pils. Most boils are 60-75 minutes. 175F whirlpool on most for ~15mins. No DMS present in the finished beer.

I do make sure to keep the lid away from the pot. The condensation dripping back into the beer is bad frikken mojo. A good boil off rate 10%+ (mine's 15%)is probably more important than actual boil time.

[djinkc]

I have always been a little squeamish about DMS (a vegetal, cooked-corn flavor and/or aroma) because it just sounds so terribly nasty. I wonder if something has changed in homebrewing or with pils malt or whatever... because years ago people would be religiously boiling a pils-based wort for 90-minutes without exception. How could so many people conclude that 60 vs 90 makes no difference and not experience DMS?

 

Maybe my palate just isn't what it could be.  It's been rare when I have tasted it.  Nasty stuff you would never forget IMO.

[3rd party JKor]

I just don't think its as prevalent as people think. I'm sure it's an artifact of magabrewers worrying about DMS in their ultra light beers.