28 replies to this topic

[3rd party JKor]

I want to do a couple of quick beers this weekend and I'm aiming to try no sparge.  For those of you out there that do it, can you give me some pointers?

 

How do you figure mash thickness?  pH issues in a very thin mash?  any other issues with a very thin mash?

 

Typical grain absorption?  draining time?

 

Etc., etc...

[positiveContact]

I want to do a couple of quick beers this weekend and I'm aiming to try no sparge.  For those of you out there that do it, can you give me some pointers?

 

How do you figure mash thickness?  pH issues in a very thin mash?  any other issues with a very thin mash?

 

Typical grain absorption?  draining time?

 

Etc., etc...

 

I do almost no sparge (2-3 gallon batch sparge on 10 gallon batch).

 

If you can put all of the water in the mash and end up with your pre-boil volume do it.  Do not fear the thin mash.  You'll have to add more acid/salts than you have in the past but this generally is not an issue (what styles are you making).  grain absorption should be the same as it always is.  draining time isn't that much longer for me.

 

what type of mash tun are you using?

[HVB]

For the ones I have done my absorption was about 0.7qt/#.  I have noticed my pH is less than what Bru'n Water predicts so I now add salts and check it before I add any acid.  As for the drain I "tea bag" the bag before hoisting it out and just let it drain for a minute or two and give it a gentle squeeze and call it good.

 

ETA: this was my experience with a BIAB witch I consider no-sparge.

Edited by drez77, 03 September 2015 - 06:23 AM.

[positiveContact]

For the ones I have done my absorption was about 0.7qt/#.  I have noticed my pH is less than what Bru'n Water predicts so I now add salts and check it before I add any acid.  As for the drain I "tea bag" the bag before hoisting it out and just let it drain for a minute or two and give it a gentle squeeze and call it good.

 

I'm not sure he's doing BIAB but if he is what drez said regarding absorption and draining b/c I have no idea.

[HVB]

I'm not sure he's doing BIAB but if he is what drez said regarding absorption and draining b/c I have no idea.

That is why I added my edit.  I am not sure if he is doing BIAB or using a MLT.  I just figured I would add my info in since it is fresh in my mind.

[3rd party JKor]

Session IPA and a RyePA.  Both in the 1.040-1.050 range.

 

I'm using my bucket RIMS for the mash.  I'll be able to get the whole mash into the mash tun.  It's just a pair of nested 5gal buckets, so I can pull out the inner bucket (which has a perfed bottom) and let it drain over the pot.

[positiveContact]

Session IPA and a RyePA.  Both in the 1.040-1.050 range.

 

I'm using my bucket RIMS for the mash.  I'll be able to get the whole mash into the mash tun.  It's just a pair of nested 5gal buckets, so I can pull out the inner bucket (which has a perfed bottom) and let it drain over the pot.

 

I would guess that would be more like the typical grain absorption situation and not really like a BIAB absorption rate.  those are great beers for no sparge since they can take a lot of sulfate (so you can use a lot of gypsum to adjust pH).

[neddles]

My no sparge is BIAB so take it for what it is. Basically you need to add to the mash tun your pre-boil volume + grain absorption volume + grains. Mash thickness is whatever it turns out to be.  I won't guess what your absorption will be so make your best estimate. Water could not be easier. Just plug full mash volume into BrunWater and set the sparge to 0.0gal. I have no pH issues at all with the thinner mash. I use RO water so that also simplifies things. With RO you can withhold a some water from the mash and add it later for step mashes without changing the pH in any significant way (zero buffering power). Ususally I just direct fire the tun, but I don't know if your setup allows for that.  I find BrunWater over-estimates my pH by about 0.5 units pretty consistently so I account for that when calculating acid additions.

 

Anything else I didn't cover?

[Brauer]

I add water to about 2-2.5 qt/# for the beta rest, with all the salts needed for the full volume. I add the remaining volume needed to hit kettle volume for the alpha rest. I recirculate a little at the end, then just drain at full speed.

My absorption is 0.12 gal/#, plus dead volume.

Thinner mashes will hit a higher pH, than thicker ones, but your calculator of choice should account for that. The extra salt in the beta step doesn't lower the pH enough to matter.

[positiveContact]

I add water to about 2-2.5 qt/# for the beta rest, with all the salts needed for the full volume. I add the remaining volume needed to hit kettle volume for the alpha rest. I recirculate a little at the end, then just drain at full speed.

My absorption is 0.12 gal/#, plus dead volume.

Thinner mashes will hit a higher pH, than thicker ones, but your calculator of choice should account for that. The extra salt in the beta step doesn't lower the pH enough to matter.

 

this is another nice advantage.  it makes step mash by infusion pretty doable.

[MakeMeHoppy]

I didn't see the answer if you are doing BIAB or not. If not, why not just mash at normal thinkness at the end drain the first running and add the remaining water which is a single batch sparge. Alternatively mash normally and add the remaining water at that time before draining.

Thinking more I believe the real difference with BIAB is that you only have one combo mash tun/ kettle. If you have a seperate mash tun and kettle I don't see any advantage of BIAB or no sparge over a single sparge.

Edited by MakeMeHoppy, 03 September 2015 - 09:23 AM.

[positiveContact]

I didn't see the answer if you are doing BIAB or not. If not, why not just mash at normal thinkness at the end drain the first running and add the remaining water which is a single batch sparge. Alternatively mash normally and add the remaining water at that time before draining.

Thinking more I believe the real difference with BIAB is that you only have one combo mash tun/ kettle. If you have a seperate mash tun and kettle I don't see any advantage of BIAB or no sparge over a single sparge.

 

he's mashing in a bucket so it's not really like BIAB.

[denny]

When I do no sparge, I mash at 1.75-2 qt./lb. After the mash is done, I add the rest of the water I need for boil volume before running off.

[positiveContact]

When I do no sparge, I mash at 1.75-2 qt./lb. After the mash is done, I add the rest of the water I need for boil volume before running off.

 

reason?  thinner mash should convert more readily right?  also more mass means the temp will hold better.

[3rd party JKor]

I didn't see the answer if you are doing BIAB or not. If not, why not just mash at normal thickness at the end drain the first running and add the remaining water which is a single batch sparge. Alternatively mash normally and add the remaining water at that time before draining.

Thinking more I believe the real difference with BIAB is that you only have one combo mash tun/ kettle. If you have a seperate mash tun and kettle I don't see any advantage of BIAB or no sparge over a single sparge.

 

 

I could do that, but it's just an extra step.  You would need to measure out and heat the sparge water.  The whole point of no sparge for me is the 'one touch' mash.  I'm trying to remove all unnecessary steps.

[positiveContact]

I could do that, but it's just an extra step.  You would need to measure out and heat the sparge water.  The whole point of no sparge for me is the 'one touch' mash.  I'm trying to remove all unnecessary steps.

 

it's not really much more measuring and heating?  not exactly exact.  in fact I hear you can sparge cold with little effect.  it's a little bit of extra work but not much. 

[3rd party JKor]

it's not really much more measuring and heating?  not exactly exact.  in fact I hear you can sparge cold with little effect.  it's a little bit of extra work but not much. 

 

 

Is it really going to get me anything?  A couple of points of efficiency?

 

As of today I have 365 pounds of base malt and I'm using 6 pounds of malt per batch.  Efficiency is of no concern.

[positiveContact]

Is it really going to get me anything?  A couple of points of efficiency?

 

As of today I have 365 pounds of base malt and I'm using 6 pounds of malt per batch.  Efficiency is of no concern.

 

I wasn't arguing for you to do it - just noting some aspects about batch sparging.  in fact I'd pretty much go no sparge all the time if I could fit everything in my mash tun but I haven't made anything low enough gravity lately to try to do that.  if I ever go back and make a 5 gallon batch again I should be able to do it no problem though.

[3rd party JKor]

Single batch sparging is not that much different than what I'm already doing.  I add all my sparge water at once then slowly draw the wort off.  No mixing.

[denny]

reason?  thinner mash should convert more readily right?  also more mass means the temp will hold better.

That's just the way I learned to do no sparge. Old habits die hard.