40 replies to this topic

[Glacies]

a key part is getting examples that have been well handled on their way to you.

 

That's why the freshness really popped at me

[neddles]

huh - I thought they were supposed to be equivalent.

Weyermann makes an aromatic malt (they call it Abbey Malt 16-19ºL) and a Melanoidin Malt (23-31ºL) so I certainly would not expect them to be equivalent across maltsters. 

 

Abbey

 

 

Weyermann® Abbey Malt® is a highly friable base malt with pronounced malty aromas, and assertive flavors such as honey, nuts as well as hints of chocolate.  Suitable for traditional Abbey ales, as well as Trappist beers.  Also well suited for a full range for Belgian beer styles, including fruit beers.

 

Melanoidin

 

 

Weyermann® Melanoidin is a kilned specialty malt with an intense malt aroma and unique brewing characteristics. It has a high degree of modification of both proteins and starches, excellent friability, low β-glucan values, and high acidity. These attributes help promote flavor stability, add body, and produce a smooth mouthfeel. Weyermann® Melanoidin malt adds a deep amber to red-brown color to finished beer. The rich malt flavor has notes of honey and biscuit. Melanoidin malt is best used in dark or red-colored beers such as amber ales, scottish ales, Irish red ales, bocks, and Kellerbier.

 

 

a key part is getting examples that have been well handled on their way to you.

 

Definitely.

[positiveContact]

One of the best Oktoberfests i've ever made was super simple:

 

5lb Weyermann Pils

5lb Weyermann Munich (I or II, doesn't really matter)

1lb of light Caramunich (1, I think it was)

 

Tettnanger for bittering to ~25-ish IBUs, and a little bit of Hallertau to 3-5 IBUs, with 5 min left in the boil

 

34/70 was the yeast (or 2124 if you prefer a liquid strain)

 

Single infusion mash, and I got plenty of maltiness from that.

 

I would drink the hell out of that beer.

[Bklmt2000]

I would drink the hell out of that beer.

 

I did.  And I (somewhat hazily) recall it didn't last long on tap. 

[Big Nake]

There is a list HERE that may jog your memory. There are American and german Oktoberfest/Marzens on that list.

Also, I thought of a couple other things. 1) Spaten's version is actually "Ur-Marzen" which means that they actually created that style of beer. I think the UR- means that's the original version of that particular style of beer... for better or worse. 2) It appears that Hallertau hops are typically used in the bittering of a Marzenbier. I'm sure you could use Spalt, Tettnanger, Magnum, etc. but I just went back and checked my notes and on the last 3-4 Oktoberfest batches I have made, I bittered with Hallertau.

[shaggaroo]

Some German breweries actually use those terms interchangeably... like PAULANER OKTOBERFEST/MARZEN. 

FTR I actually think Paulaner Oktoberfest/Märzen is a different bier than Paulaner Festbier. I always think of Festbier as a ramped up Helles, a TurboHelles if you will.

Edited by shaggaroo, 19 July 2017 - 02:45 PM.

[Big Nake]

FTR I actually think Paulaner Oktoberfest/Märzen is a different bier than Paulaner Festbier. I always think of Festbier as a ramped up Helles, a TurboHelles if you will.

I agree and I think it's been mentioned here that "Oktoberfest" as it once was is no longer the style served at the festival... it's more of a higher-ABV helles as you say. Actually, I didn't even know there was a Paulaner Festbier. The last few times I picked up any Paulaner product it was Paulaner Premium Pils or the Oktoberfest/Marzen. All this beer talk is making me thirsty.

Btw... Glacies: Was the beer you had on draft? If so, it may be much harder to recall.

[Bklmt2000]

In "The Brewmaster's Table", Garrett Oliver discusses Maerzen/O-fest beer at length, and one of the points he made was, the "Oktoberfest" beer most commonly encountered at the big bash in Munich was a higher-ABV helles, and not the original/true "Maerzen" beer.

 

I think (I'm probably wrong) he also mentioned that beers labeled as "festbiers" were these higher-ABV helles beers, and not the more traditional Maerzen/Oktoberfest beers.

 

Sidebar: If any of youse haven't read it yet, "The Brewmaster's Table" is a terrific read.  A bit dated (originally published ca 2003/2005) but for food and beer pairings, it's a must-read.

[HVB]

FTR I actually think Paulaner Oktoberfest/Märzen is a different bier than Paulaner Festbier. I always think of Festbier as a ramped up Helles, a TurboHelles if you will.

Agree with this.

[pkrone]

For something like Paulaner Weisn (which is my favorite fest bier) you might try

70% pils

30% light munich

OG 1.056

FG 1.009

IBU's 21

[HVB]

For something like Paulaner Weisn (which is my favorite fest bier) you might try
70% pils
30% light munich
OG 1.056
FG 1.009
IBU's 21

That sounds good. Last year I did 50/50 pils/Munich 2 and it was good but a bit too much Munich.

[Big Nake]

Check out the link I posted a few posts back and notice the wide range of colors on these so-called Marzens, Oktoberfests and Festbiers. Some look like Miller Lite. Some look like a Vienna lager. One clue would be Glacies mentioning what the color of the beer was (if he remembers) and that may lead to more clues.

[pkrone]

Proof that not every festbier is a marzen and vice versa.     I tend to like the paler festbiers that are like a big helles.    Like Paulaner Weisn

[Glacies]

Well, I was in my beer mecca and bought all the beers last weekend. I got home and as luck would have it - I Found it!!!! And I undrestand my confusion. I got Paulaner Marzen, and Paulaner Octoberfest Weisn.

 

It was the Weisn!

 

Special thanks to Hacker Pschorr too.

 

So happy I have these beers now - Shame I only got 6 packs. They are pure gold in my house at the moment. Going to have to dig up some clone recipes.

 

What makes this a Weisn?

[Big Nake]

Possibly the yeast. I'm not sure I've had Oktoberfest Weisn. If its like hefeweizen then Wyeast 3868 might be a key. Does it have a banana and clove profile?

[Bklmt2000]

Well, I was in my beer mecca and bought all the beers last weekend. I got home and as luck would have it - I Found it!!!! And I undrestand my confusion. I got Paulaner Marzen, and Paulaner Octoberfest Weisn.

 

It was the Weisn!

 

Special thanks to Hacker Pschorr too.

 

So happy I have these beers now - Shame I only got 6 packs. They are pure gold in my house at the moment. Going to have to dig up some clone recipes.

 

What makes this a Weisn?

 

It's called Weisn (or "meadow") for where the first Oktoberfest was held in the early 1800's. Not a reference to the beer being a hefe, which it certainly isn't.

 

The yeast is likely a Munich strain, perhaps 2308.

[Big Nake]

Oh yeah... Missed that. Not weizen, Weisn pronounced VEEzen. Yep, probably 2308. You could always try to harvest some from a bottle but there's usually not much in there. That's a great beer, btw.

[neddles]

What kind of OG would be typical of one of these festbiers/weisn/ramped up Helles?

[Bklmt2000]

What kind of OG would be typical of one of these festbiers/weisn/ramped up Helles?

 

Anywhere in the 1.050-1.060 range, but more commonly in the middle to high end of this range.

[Poptop]

Kinda on topic here. This is what I put together to brew this coming Sunday. A little on style with a tinge of unorthodox

Recipe: MikeToberfest
Style: Oktoberfest/Märzen
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.25 gal
Estimated OG: 1.053 SG, Estimated Color: 10.8 SRM, Estimated IBU: 23.1 IBUs, Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00%, Boil Time: 40 Minutes

5 lbs 8.0 oz Pils Malt (2 Row) Ger (3.0 SRM)
3 lbs 8.0 oz Vienna Barke Vienna (3.8 SRM)
2 lbs 8.0 oz Munich Malt (9.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Aromatic Malt (26.0 SRM)
1.0 oz Midnight Wheat (744.0 SRM)
0.90 oz Mt. Hood [6.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 6 14.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 7 2.1 IBUs
0.50 oz Mt. Hood [6.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 3.7 IBUs
0.50 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 9 1.2 IBUs
0.50 oz Mt. Hood [6.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 10 2.0 IBUs
2.0 pkg Saflager Lager (DCL/Fermentis #W- Yeast 11 -

Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge, Total Grain Weight: 11 lbs 13.0 oz

Edited by Steppedonapoptop, 16 August 2017 - 08:17 AM.