483 replies to this topic

[SchwanzBrewer]

Well, when the lightning win you'll owe me beer anyway!

 

I just made room in the fridge today. I'm down to 1 keg of porter and 1 keg of kolsch that is almost gone. By the time I keg the new kolsch and alt, there ought to be room for two more beers. Pilsner will be next week and then possibly MLPA. IWhen I brew MLPA again, no matter what it will be sent to you, Ken because I'd like to know how it compares to the best versions you've brewed. I'll probably send back your fancy bottles too!

[Big Nake]

Well, when the lightning win you'll owe me beer anyway!   I just made room in the fridge today. I'm down to 1 keg of porter and 1 keg of kolsch that is almost gone. By the time I keg the new kolsch and alt, there ought to be room for two more beers. Pilsner will be next week and then possibly MLPA. IWhen I brew MLPA again, no matter what it will be sent to you, Ken because I'd like to know how it compares to the best versions you've brewed. I'll probably send back your fancy bottles too!

Woot! Maybe I should send you this version I made yesterday. A bit more pale, a bit less crystal, a bit more sulfate so maybe a crisper MLPA. Also, since we were talking about American Pub Ale, I could change the wording to Memory Lapse Pub Ale and it would still be MLPA. Cheers friend... hope you enjoyed the game tonight.

[MyaCullen]

Ken

 

have you ever done this as a Lager?

 

same grain bill and hops, but with, say 2124?

[Big Nake]

Ken   have you ever done this as a Lager?   same grain bill and hops, but with, say 2124?

I have not. My guess is that it would be great and I love 2124 so... time to rub my chin?

[neddles]

I have not. My guess is that it would be great and I love 2124 so... time to rub my chin?

Use 2 row and a solid whack of Mt. Hood late and you'll be dangerously close to Great Lakes B.C.'s Dortmunder Gold. A poor example of a Dortmunder so I'm told, but a very tasty beer nonetheless.

[Big Nake]

Use 2 row and a solid whack of Mt. Hood late and you'll be dangerously close to Great Lakes B.C.'s Dortmunder Gold. A poor example of a Dortmunder so I'm told, but a very tasty beer nonetheless.

Wait, I lost ya. MLPA as a lager and late Mt. Hoods would be Dortmunder Gold? Take out the crystal, I assume?

[neddles]

Wait, I lost ya. MLPA as a lager and late Mt. Hoods would be Dortmunder Gold? Take out the crystal, I assume?

httpss://www.greatlakesbrewing.com/sites/default/files/Dortmunder%20Sell%20Sheet.pdf

 

Just what came to my mind.  This is a new fact sheet. Do you know this beer? It's just 2 row and C-60. I'm going to guess less C-60 that you use in MLPA. The old fact sheet used to clarify that cascade was for bittering and Mt. Hood was for flavor.

[Big Nake]

httpss://www.greatlakesbrewing.com/sites/default/files/Dortmunder%20Sell%20Sheet.pdf   Just what came to my mind.  This is a new fact sheet. Do you know this beer? It's just 2 row and C-60. I'm going to guess less C-60 that you use in MLPA. The old fact sheet used to clarify that cascade was for bittering and Mt. Hood was for flavor.

Huh. On the one hand, I dislike beers that say they are "this" but the ingredients would suggest otherwise. Cascade and Mt. Hood in a Dort is not really right in my book and many, many American breweries seem to do this. OTOH, good beer is good beer. I have had this beer but it's been YEARS. I do remember listening to a podcast with Jamil and some others where they were comparing GL Dortmunder Gold to Ayinger Jahrhundert. Their comments about the GLDG were not friendly in any way but that was probably not a fair comparison. Sort of like the Kolsch I had by Metropolitan where he used Nugget to bitter and Santiam for flavor. Weird but a nice beer, no question.

[neddles]

Huh. On the one hand, I dislike beers that say they are "this" but the ingredients would suggest otherwise. Cascade and Mt. Hood in a Dort is not really right in my book and many, many American breweries seem to do this. OTOH, good beer is good beer. I have had this beer but it's been YEARS. I do remember listening to a podcast with Jamil and some others where they were comparing GL Dortmunder Gold to Ayinger Jahrhundert. Their comments about the GLDG were not friendly in any way but that was probably not a fair comparison. Sort of like the Kolsch I had by Metropolitan where he used Nugget to bitter and Santiam for flavor. Weird but a nice beer, no question.

My guess is it is not to style but as you say good beer is good beer. I remember hearing that podcast as well at one point. In fact I have listened to a lot of those podcasts and I cant ever recall Jamil giving praise to a midwestern beer. FWIW.

[Big Nake]

My guess is it is not to style but as you say good beer is good beer. I remember hearing that podcast as well at one point. In fact I have listened to a lot of those podcasts and I cant ever recall Jamil giving praise to a midwestern beer. FWIW.

Well, he's probably a style-Nazi and considers various ingredients to be 'wrong' in certain styles or whatever. I do find it weird that someone (a commercial brewer, no less) would think of putting C60 in a Dortmunder. If I were going to do that, I might just call it something else. It's not like 99% of Americans know what a Dortmunder is. All of this makes my mind wander about how commercial breweries refer to their beers. I assume that the vast majority of US beer drinkers don't know about these styles so maybe a brewery calls their kolsch a "blonde" or their alt an "amber" or whatever. I apologize for the stream-of-conscienceness rambling.

[MyaCullen]

OK I'm gonna make a bastardized Lager from this base

 

7.5 lbs GW Premium 2 Row

1 lb flaked wheat

8 oz Cara Munich 80

8 oz Crystal 20L

 

hockhurst step mash

 

1.25 oz of 7.0 %AA Sterling as a FWH to approx 25 IBU

 

Amber Malty water profile

 

2124 yeast 

[Big Nake]

Yum, Mic... that sounds awesome.

[SchwanzBrewer]

I'm brewing a version of this, more true to the original, in August after I get back from the keys. So I'll send you some bottles in September likely, Ken. 

[Big Nake]

I'm brewing a version of this, more true to the original, in August after I get back from the keys. So I'll send you some bottles in September likely, Ken.

Rich, this beer was kegged yesterday, chilled overnight and is carbing now. It's the "slightly more pale and slightly more crisp" (a little more sulfate) version of MLPA. I'm going to sample it on Monday when it's finished carbing and based on how it tastes, I will send a big bottle your way. I think I mentioned that the best versions of MLPA were made before I futzed with the water. That tells me that there was slightly more sulfate in the water than chloride. Once I started playing with the water, I was using more chloride to boost calcium than I was using sulfate and many styles come out nice & smooth with more chloride. But this particular beer could benefit from a bit more sulfate. It looked and smelled heavenly going into the keg so fingers are crossed and hopes are high. Cheers.

[Big Nake]

This may be one of the best batches of MLPA I have made (and I have made a lot). It's a little lighter in color (less crystal) and has a bit more sulfate in the water which brings it away from that edge-of-too-malty. The color in the pic is darker than the beer looks in person but it's really delicious.

[positiveContact]

sounds like a winner ken.  so where did the water numbers end up?

[Big Nake]

Still very modest by most standards: Ca: 60, Mg: 12, Na: 13, Cl: 48, SO4: 52, HCO3: 138.

I am in no hurry to get chloride or sulfate numbers into the 200s or 300s. The amount of CaCl and CaSO4 that I add is to boost my low calcium into what I consider to be an acceptable range. With those additions, I can change the ratio and create maltier or crisper beers.

[neddles]

I am in no hurry to get chloride or sulfate numbers into the 200s or 300s.

No way, not on a beer like this. 

[positiveContact]

Still very modest by most standards: Ca: 60, Mg: 12, Na: 13, Cl: 48, SO4: 52, HCO3: 138.

I am in no hurry to get chloride or sulfate numbers into the 200s or 300s. The amount of CaCl and CaSO4 that I add is to boost my low calcium into what I consider to be an acceptable range. With those additions, I can change the ratio and create maltier or crisper beers.

 

with a beer like MLPA I wouldn't go much past 80 ppm sulfate.  I think it could start to get out of balance.  prior to this batch what kind of sulfate and chloride levels would you be dealing with?

Edited by Evil_Morty, 27 July 2015 - 05:51 AM.

[Big Nake]

Before I started futzing with water, there would be the source numbers in this beer: Ca 34, Mg 12, Na 13, Cl 21, SO4 27 and HCO3 138. Those versions were very good and my guess is that the higher SO4 than Cl numbers helped. When I started boosting the Ca and playing with water, I seemed to favor added CaCl and in many styles that was okay but I really needed to look at what I was doing and allow for more SO4. I made some beers years ago where I used much more SO4 and I decided that I was overly sensitive to sulfate so I didn't use as much of it. But with a better understanding of how all this stuff plays together, I'm changing that a little bit. This may be a permanent change to this recipe (slightly less crystal, a blend of two crystals and more sulfate) because it really is outstanding.