19 replies to this topic

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

I check my mash pH and very often I need to raise the pH. So in goes some chalk. Stir and wait. Check again - can barely see any diff so more chalk. I do this a few times and then just say f it b/c I feel like it's getting to extreme. Very often it's like I'm stuck just below 5.2 and it wouldn't matter how much chalk I added. Any ideas what's happening?

[boo boo]

If you are using quality strips to test with then hows your water buffering capabilities?

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

If you are using quality strips to test with then hows your water buffering capabilities?

No idea about the answer to that question. How would I tell?

[RommelMagic]

I check my mash pH and very often I need to raise the pH. So in goes some chalk. Stir and wait. Check again - can barely see any diff so more chalk. I do this a few times and then just say f it b/c I feel like it's getting to extreme. Very often it's like I'm stuck just below 5.2 and it wouldn't matter how much chalk I added. Any ideas what's happening?

If you can afford it, fork out some cash on a pH meter

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

If you can afford it, fork out some cash on a pH meter

Afford is a relative term. I'd rather not buy one. Maybe I'll try some higher quality pH strips...

[boo boo]

No idea about the answer to that question. How would I tell?

If you are using quality strips that will tell the pH pretty accuratly and you can't seem to get your mash to move using chaulk, thenthe buffering of your mash would need to be overcome. In other words, do you have your water profile, in which to see what you need to do to get your pH where you need it to go?I used cheap strips years ago and for the last few years broke down and shelled out the loonies for a meter. Colorphast strips are supposed to be good also.

[EWW]

Afford is a relative term. I'd rather not buy one. Maybe I'll try some higher quality pH strips...

best I've found are the colorphast ph test strips

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

If you are using quality strips that will tell the pH pretty accuratly and you can't seem to get your mash to move using chaulk, thenthe buffering of your mash would need to be overcome. In other words, do you have your water profile, in which to see what you need to do to get your pH where you need it to go?I used cheap strips years ago and for the last few years broke down and shelled out the loonies for a meter. Colorphast strips are supposed to be good also.

I've been using my water report with Palmer's spreadsheet. I generally shoot for the middle of the RA range and then work from there when I actually take a measurement...

[dagomike]

Having to raise your pH on the beers in your sig makes me thing something is wrong. Are you chilling the sample to room temp? You could try getting those colorphast strips. A meter is always nice because of the certainty, but nothing wrong with good strips.

[jwatkins56550]

I feel like my strips are crap too. What brand are you using?

[dagomike]

ColorpHast are probably the best out there. Give them a shot.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Having to raise your pH on the beers in your sig makes me thing something is wrong. Are you chilling the sample to room temp? You could try getting those colorphast strips. A meter is always nice because of the certainty, but nothing wrong with good strips.

I need additional alkalinity for anything over 9.1 according to the spreadsheet.

[zymot]

Judging by all the threads over the years on the subject, mash pH is one of the most complex subjects and difficult for homebrewers to wrap their head around. I will not pretend to say I really understand it all.The single best source I know of is the water section in John Palmer's How To Brew. Read the section a couple times and then work through the example with the nomograph. Then use the nomograph for your water, see what kind of water you have.On the board of green, there was an excellent thread on the subject. When it comes back up, find the thread and save a copy.

Help me read my water report...please! by rabeb25 Oct 13 2006

John Palmer contributed several replies.I am lucky. I had my water tested and it is pretty decent. I add some 5.2 buffer and do not worry about it.I am sure mash pH will be one of the most read topics of brewbasser's Tech Talk symposiums.zymot

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Judging by all the threads over the years on the subject, mash pH is one of the most complex subjects and difficult for homebrewers to wrap their head around. I will not pretend to say I really understand it all.The single best source I know of is the water section in John Palmer's How To Brew. Read the section a couple times and then work through the example with the nomograph. Then use the nomograph for your water, see what kind of water you have.On the board of green, there was an excellent thread on the subject. When it comes back up, find the thread and save a copy.John Palmer contributed several replies.I am lucky. I had my water tested and it is pretty decent. I add some 5.2 buffer and do not worry about it.I am sure mash pH will be one of the most read topics of brewbasser's Tech Talk symposiums.zymot

I should note that I'm missing my magnesium levels (not included in the report) so using those nomographs is kind of tricky.

[zymot]

I should note that I'm missing my magnesium levels (not included in the report) so using those nomographs is kind of tricky.

Magnesium is a big factor in Palmer's residual alkalinity concept. Without that, you are shooting in the dark.I cannot point to a specific reference, but as I understand it, it is trickier than measure the pH mix in XYZ to swing you pH in the other direction.If you have promash or beersmith, they have water calculators. Yo ucan go with a before/after + delta water profile. Plus there is a variety of resources available on line. There used to be something called brewater, a stand alone app that was very nice.I suggest you consider 1 of 2 paths:1- Get some 5.2 from five star. Use it on some bottled water and see what kind of results you get. 2- Use some distilled or reverse osmosis filtered water, add a predefined amount of brewing salts so you can be confident of what type of water you start with. Observe the results.zymot

[BrewerGeorge]

I need additional alkalinity for anything over 9.1 according to the spreadsheet.

That sounds a little off to me unless you have really soft water. Frankly, if you don't have the Mg levels, you're just guessing anyway. Send a sample off to Ward Labs. Anybody ready to mess with mash pH should do this as their first step.Colorphast strips are great. Don't mess with the crappy strips. Colorphast are good enough, IMO, that they make a pH meter unnecessary. You should NOT have to cool the sample because the 5.2 goal is at mash temp. IF you cool the sample, the goal goes up to (I think) 5.4.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

That sounds a little off to me unless you have really soft water. Frankly, if you don't have the Mg levels, you're just guessing anyway. Send a sample off to Ward Labs. Anybody ready to mess with mash pH should do this as their first step.Colorphast strips are great. Don't mess with the crappy strips. Colorphast are good enough, IMO, that they make a pH meter unnecessary. You should NOT have to cool the sample because the 5.2 goal is at mash temp. IF you cool the sample, the goal goes up to (I think) 5.4.

I'm looking at their website and it isn't clear to me how exactly I send the water in. What's the general procedure and how much does it cost?

[NWPines]

I'm looking at their website and it isn't clear to me how exactly I send the water in. What's the general procedure and how much does it cost?

I recommend the W-6 test, which is $16.50 You can use any clean plastic container (an empty water bottle works well). Rinse it several times with the water to be tested and then fill with at least 8 oz. Include payment and your address and email address for them to send the results to. Mail to:Ward Labs4007 Cherry Ave, PO Box 788Kearney, Nebraska 68848-0788

Edited by NWPines, 31 March 2009 - 04:42 PM.

[ThroatwobblerMangrove]

Also - here is my H20 report (minus the mg level)Ca - 5 ppmMg - ???Alkalinity as CaCO3 - 22 ppmSodium - 26 ppmChloride - 26 ppmSulfate - 13 ppmWater pH - 7.81It really is pretty soft I think.

[NWPines]

Also - here is my H20 report (minus the mg level)Ca - 5 ppmMg - ???Alkalinity as CaCO3 - 22 ppmSodium - 26 ppmChloride - 26 ppmSulfate - 13 ppmWater pH - 7.81It really is pretty soft I think.

Yeah, that's pretty soft. That should be a great brewing water, easily adjusted to brew just about any style.My water is very similar, but even lower in sodium, chloride, and sulfate:Ca - 3.5 ppmMg - 0 ppmAlkalinity as CaCO3 - 23 ppmNa - 5.4 ppmCl - 2.3 ppmSulfate - 4.6 ppmpH - 7.8