86 replies to this topic

[positiveContact]

I forgot the bazooka tube might screw up the fly sparge.  I'm 100% set on fly sparging, I can't batch sparge on this system anyway, since it's 2 vessels.

 

no sparge it.  living tannin free!

[HVB]

no sparge it.  living tannin free!

 

For this size that is how I would go too.

[3rd party JKor]

I don't know.  No sparge rubs me the wrong way.  Something about taking shortcuts.  As you can tell, that's not really my thing. 

 

Either way I'll be able to do some good side by sides of the different methods.  With the full automation and small batch size it would be pretty easy to do two batches.  one fly, one no sparge, in a single night. 

[positiveContact]

I don't know.  No sparge rubs me the wrong way.  Something about taking shortcuts.  As you can tell, that's not really my thing. 

 

Either way I'll be able to do some good side by sides of the different methods.  With the full automation and small batch size it would be pretty easy to do two batches.  one fly, one no sparge, in a single night. 

 

a lot of people seem to prefer no sparge in terms of results and really the difference in efficiency is not a big deal for small batch sizes.

[3rd party JKor]

a lot of people seem to prefer no sparge in terms of results and really the difference in efficiency is not a big deal for small batch sizes.

 

 

Actually, due to the size of the vessels I chose for my system the efficiency loss will limit the potential gravity of my wort quite a bit.  Fine for average strength beers, though.  I've wanted to try a side by side for a while, but never got around to it.  I certainly wouldn't mind the extra grain for the time and complexity savings.

[positiveContact]

Actually, due to the size of the vessels I chose for my system the efficiency loss will limit the potential gravity of my wort quite a bit.  Fine for average strength beers, though.  I've wanted to try a side by side for a while, but never got around to it.  I certainly wouldn't mind the extra grain for the time and complexity savings.

 

I haven't made a low enough gravity beer to fit all of the grain and water in my tun for a 10 gallon batch.  Last batch was a 1.052 beer and I still had to sparge with a couple of gallons of water.  I maybe could have brought it down to 1 gallon but the tun would have been filled right up to the brim.

[3rd party JKor]

Since I only have two pots, one will have the mash and the other the sparge water.  The plan is to pump all the sparge water to the MLT then begin transferring the wort to the BK/HLT, so there can't be an water left in the BK when I start the "sparge".  I.e. everything need to fit into the MLT. 

 

In a way it's similar to no sparge, in that everything goes into the MLT, but it acts as a fly sparge system and should have similar efficiency so not as much grain is needed.

[HVB]

Since I only have two pots, one will have the mash and the other the sparge water.  The plan is to pump all the sparge water to the MLT then begin transferring the wort to the BK/HLT, so there can't be an water left in the BK when I start the "sparge".  I.e. everything need to fit into the MLT. 

 

In a way it's similar to no sparge, in that everything goes into the MLT, but it acts as a fly sparge system and should have similar efficiency so not as much grain is needed.

basically this right  https://www.alenuts....s/brutus20.html

[positiveContact]

Since I only have two pots, one will have the mash and the other the sparge water.  The plan is to pump all the sparge water to the MLT then begin transferring the wort to the BK/HLT, so there can't be an water left in the BK when I start the "sparge".  I.e. everything need to fit into the MLT. 

 

In a way it's similar to no sparge, in that everything goes into the MLT, but it acts as a fly sparge system and should have similar efficiency so not as much grain is needed.

 

I'm not quite seeing how that isn't a no sparge.  does the "sparge" sit on top of the mash before you start draining the mash?  I would have expected it to mix in.

[3rd party JKor]

basically this right  https://www.alenuts....s/brutus20.html

 

Kind of, except I transfer all the water to the top of the MLT before starting to move wort.  There's no mixing of wort and fresh water, as in the Brutus 20 diagram.

 

 

I'm not quite seeing how that isn't a no sparge.  does the "sparge" sit on top of the mash before you start draining the mash?  I would have expected it to mix in.

 

 

Yup, just sits on top.  That's how I've been sparging for a while except I had a separate HLT so I could add water in a few shots while running off to the brew kettle.  Here I'm just eliminating the HLT and adding all the sparge water to the MLT at once.  I get ~85% efficiency on a typical gravity beer using this method.

 

ETA:  I don't add the sparge water until after mashout.

 

ETA2:  Since it's such a slow process to draw all of the water through the bed of grain (30-45mins usually), flow stays pretty laminar inside the bed so there's not a lot of mixing.  Essentially a 'front' of fresh water is contacting the grains throughout the entire 'sparge' process, just as it would in a system that continuously sprays/drips water onto the grain bed.

Edited by JKor, 18 March 2015 - 10:43 AM.

[3rd party JKor]

The brains...

 

httpss://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/50235694/2015-03-18%2022.22.10.jpg

[zymot]

The brains...

Step #1Power BoardCheck.

[3rd party JKor]

Step #2

Write a program to make a blinky LED

Check.

[3rd party JKor]

I got pretty much all of my electronics in.  I managed to get the ultrasonic distance sensors working.  It shouldn't be too difficult to convert their output into liquid level, I just don't know how consistent they'll be.  With some quick testing the distance readout seems to be pretty repeatable.  There's some reading-to-reading noise, but a popped an averaging function into the code and I was getting rock solid readouts, as long as there was no interference.  I made some low humming noises right near the sensor and that threw the readings off a bit.  It was only a few millimeters, which would equate to maybe 4-6 oz in liquid level for the system I'm using it on.  Probably no big deal, but I'll have to see if it can keep that level of performance in the real system.

[zymot]

Valve Layout Rev1: httpss://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/50235694/2015-03-15%2022.47.44.jpg Still need work on the spacing but I wanted to get everything laid out properly to make sure I roughly had the right parts and get a better visual on how much space everything will take up. I've been dutifully watching Arduino programming tutorials on Youtube so I can get the control side started when my new controller comes in later this week.  I need to get my couplings in, then I should be able to start the welding.  Finally got my TIG out of storage.  Hope it still works! 

I am planning my new system. I got two solenoid valves. #1 sends wort through the HERMS, #2 bypasses the HERMS and returns the wort to the MT.My head explodes with all relay style logic you show in that maze.

[3rd party JKor]

I am planning my new system. I got two solenoid valves. #1 sends wort through the HERMS, #2 bypasses the HERMS and returns the wort to the MT.My head explodes with all relay style logic you show in that maze.

 

That's 2 more valves than I had in my HERMS.  I just let it run through the coil 100% of the time and controlled the HERMS bath temp.

[3rd party JKor]

I ordered this motor to do the mash stirring.  Tons of torque for the price.  It's probably overkill, but it was about as cheap as anything else I could find.  A saw a few recommendations for ice cream maker motors for mash stirring, but the RPM seemed a little high to me and I didn't feel like ripping apart the housing and figuring out how to mount it.  Plus i couldn't find any torque rating on them.  This wiper motor will easily handle the task, it has two speeds (35RPM and 50 RPM), plus it's DC so I can tweak the speed even further via PWM or lowering the input voltage if I decide I don't like one of the set speeds.

[zymot]

I ordered this motor to do the mash stirring.  Tons of torque for the price.  It's probably overkill, but it was about as cheap as anything else I could find.  A saw a few recommendations for ice cream maker motors for mash stirring, but the RPM seemed a little high to me and I didn't feel like ripping apart the housing and figuring out how to mount it.  Plus i couldn't find any torque rating on them.  This wiper motor will easily handle the task, it has two speeds (35RPM and 50 RPM), plus it's DC so I can tweak the speed even further via PWM or lowering the input voltage if I decide I don't like one of the set speeds.

 

That is a good resource. I was thinking about stirring or agitating my HLT for my HERMS set up. I could not envision being happy with any motor contraction that literally stirred the water. One thought was a motor that would raise and lower the HERMS in the HLT's water. Based on my observations with an immersion coil, you do not need much movement (about the distance between 2-3 coils) to get the benefit.

 

Of course, any solution would have to be cheaper than just buying a second pump and using that to stir the HLT.

 

One solution still on the table is pumping air bubbles up and around the HERMS coil. That should get enough agitation.

[3rd party JKor]

Why the stirrer hate?

[zymot]

Why the stirrer hate?

 

Just hard for me to visualize how I would mount a motor and then convert the rotation of the motor into a stirring motion in the HLT. What material would I make the stirring paddle out of? Where and onto what would I mount the motor and in what orientation? By the time I figured all that out, I might as well just buy a pump or an aquarium air pump.