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The (not so) Usual Suspects


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#1 neddles

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 01:50 PM

I recently had the house IPA at a new-ish brewery in Madison, WI. I really liked it. It had a great big late hop character that was a nice balance of mildly dank and floral. It was very resinous and finished with a little citrus and a touch of fruitiness. I asked which hops were used in it and after consulting with the brewer my server told me Cluster, Galena, Citra. This was clearly not an all Citra beer. I am guessing there was a fair amount of Galena used late as well. But really, I don't know how they were used. We all know the usual flavor hops we like to use and see others use often. So my question is what "off the map" hops have you guys used for flavor/aroma in IPA/APA type beers that you enjoyed and what did you get from them? How did you use/feature/pair them with other hops?

 

Off the map hops I have used: None, that's why I am asking.



#2 johnpreuss

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 01:54 PM

Denny says use Columbus and Mt. Hood in your IPA!!!

 

:notworthy:



#3 Big Nake

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 01:57 PM

I find myself in a rut from time to time so I like to try other hops occasionally.  We were just talking about Nugget (one parent is Brewer's Gold and possible subs are Galena, Magnum, Columbus).  Most commercial breweries like high alpha hops so Nugget might be popular there along with a lot of the other high-alpha varieties we see.  But for late hops, I do seem to stay in a group:  Amarillo, Citra, Mosaic (1st time today), Mt. Hood, Santiam, EKG... obviously depending on what I'm making.  I also went off the map on some German flavors recently too:  Brewer's Gold, Opal, Select and a couple others just to get out of the rut.



#4 neddles

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 01:59 PM

I find myself in a rut from time to time so I like to try other hops occasionally.  We were just talking about Nugget (one parent is Brewer's Gold and possible subs are Galena, Magnum, Columbus).  Most commercial breweries like high alpha hops so Nugget might be popular there along with a lot of the other high-alpha varieties we see.  But for late hops, I do seem to stay in a group:  Amarillo, Citra, Mosaic (1st time today), Mt. Hood, Santiam, EKG... obviously depending on what I'm making.  I also went off the map on some German flavors recently too:  Brewer's Gold, Opal, Select and a couple others just to get out of the rut.

Which one of those "new to you" hops can you not live without going forward?



#5 Big Nake

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 02:05 PM

The Amarillo & Citra together in a pale ale is very nice and I think it's my wife's favorite combo.  She might like Amarillo by itself but she likes the combo.  I made a nice beer with late Citra only (the Flat Earth Hoppy Wheat beer) and she said it was good but too dark (which it's not but whatevs).  So Amarillo is probably a staple.  I'll know more after I taste the beer I'm making today.



#6 neddles

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 02:12 PM

The Amarillo & Citra together in a pale ale is very nice and I think it's my wife's favorite combo.  She might like Amarillo by itself but she likes the combo.  I made a nice beer with late Citra only (the Flat Earth Hoppy Wheat beer) and she said it was good but too dark (which it's not but whatevs).  So Amarillo is probably a staple.  I'll know more after I taste the beer I'm making today.

Amarillo don't need no reason. If I could only have one flavor hop I think that would be it. Centennial a close second. But… back to the not so usual ones…..



#7 Big Nake

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 02:17 PM

I should mention too that I tried to get on board with a bunch of newcomers that were supposed to be great and the next big thing:  Nelson, Galaxy, Simcoe, Belma, Motueka, etc.  I probably need to revisit some of those because I may not have given them the best chance to shine but the point is that I'm not going to brew and bunch of beer with hops I don't know (and not that many others know either) just to stay current.  If I hear over & over that [this or that hop] is the bomb, I will put a recipe together and try it.  That's why I'm using the Mosaic today.  But some of these came & went very quickly and fizzled a little.  I made a nice Galaxy pale ale but I'd rather make one with Amarillo and/or Citra. 



#8 denny

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Posted 16 August 2014 - 09:45 AM

Denny says use Columbus and Mt. Hood in your IPA!!!

 

:notworthy:

 

I'll never forget the first time John Maier tasted that beer and told me it was the taste he'd been looking for!  He flipped over the Columbus/Mt. Hood combo and said he never would have thought of it.



#9 MyaCullen

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Posted 16 August 2014 - 09:59 AM

I'll never forget the first time John Maier tasted that beer and told me it was the taste he'd been looking for!  He flipped over the Columbus/Mt. Hood combo and said he never would have thought of it.

the combo used in Torpedo is a bit out there, especially th tank hop combo of Citra, Crystal and Magnum



#10 Big Nake

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Posted 16 August 2014 - 10:03 AM

Another one I was just reading about (in New Belgium's Rampant IIPA) was Calypso. Never tried it but heard a number of positive things about it. For awhile there, so many new hops were coming out and it's tough to brew with ALL of them. You don't really know if you're going to like them or not and brewing is a time-consuming thing so it's tough to stay on top. There was also a Riwaka craze there for a bit but it became hard to find.

#11 BarelyBrews

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 11:39 AM

I should mention too that I tried to get on board with a bunch of newcomers that were supposed to be great and the next big thing:  Nelson, Galaxy, Simcoe, Belma, Motueka, etc.  I probably need to revisit some of those because I may not have given them the best chance to shine but the point is that I'm not going to brew and bunch of beer with hops I don't know (and not that many others know either) just to stay current.  If I hear over & over that [this or that hop] is the bomb, I will put a recipe together and try it.  That's why I'm using the Mosaic today.  But some of these came & went very quickly and fizzled a little.  I made a nice Galaxy pale ale but I'd rather make one with Amarillo and/or Citra. 

Now that i have learned about my water profile, i have been revisiting some old hops. Not saying i can't live without it, but Nelson has been a real hit around here lately . I believe my water profile was getting in the way.



#12 Big Nake

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 11:47 AM

Now that i have learned about my water profile, i have been revisiting some old hops. Not saying i can't live without it, but Nelson has been a real hit around here lately . I believe my water profile was getting in the way.

When I went to brew with Nelson, DJ suggested doing an all-base-malt beer and then hit it with Nelson. That way the Nelson would really come through. I liked the idea and brewed it that way but this was RIGHT before I got my pale beer issues squared away and that beer did not come out well. I liked the aroma I got from the Nelson but the beer was just brewed wrong. I will probably be trying them again before long.

#13 Big Nake

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 01:59 PM

I dropped my daughter off at school this week (she's a freshman at Indiana) and I had the chance to sample a couple of beers from some of the local breweries... Upland Brewing's Pale Ale and Three Wise Men's Rocky Ripple (or something along those lines) APA. The Three Wise Men's Pale Ale was a combination of Glacier, Crystal and Cascade hops. A nice beer. I have not used a lot of Cascade or Crystal but I have used a little of each. I have never used Glacier and consider it one of Ettel's "not-so-usual suspects". If any of you were to make a pale ale with Crystal, Glacier and Cascade, how would you use them? IBUs were somewhere around 40, IIRC.

#14 neddles

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 03:05 PM

I dropped my daughter off at school this week (she's a freshman at Indiana) and I had the chance to sample a couple of beers from some of the local breweries... Upland Brewing's Pale Ale and Three Wise Men's Rocky Ripple (or something along those lines) APA. The Three Wise Men's Pale Ale was a combination of Glacier, Crystal and Cascade hops. A nice beer. I have not used a lot of Cascade or Crystal but I have used a little of each. I have never used Glacier and consider it one of Ettel's "not-so-usual suspects". If any of you were to make a pale ale with Crystal, Glacier and Cascade, how would you use them? IBUs were somewhere around 40, IIRC.

IU @ Bloomington? That's where I did undergrad. Loved it. Neither brewery was there when I was.

 

Guessing, I'd bitter with Glacier and then use a combination of all 3 at the finish.



#15 Big Nake

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 03:23 PM

IU @ Bloomington? That's where I did undergrad. Loved it. Neither brewery was there when I was. Guessing, I'd bitter with Glacier and then use a combination of all 3 at the finish.

Yep, she's a Hoosier. Nice campus and all-around good experience down there.I thought that the Cascade should be used late to get the character and I also thought Glacier early because it's clean but it's not a very high-alpha hop so it just seems unusual to use at a commercial level. It's lineage is quite cloudy... I should say "busy":1/2 Elasser5/32 Brewer's Gold1/8 Northern Brewer1/16 Bullion Hops1/32 Early Green1/32 German Aroma Hops1/64 East Kent Golding1/128 Bavarian1/128 UnknownThat's one jacked up family tree. I see things like Glacier and realize that there are dozens and dozens of hop varieties I have never used.

#16 neddles

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 03:53 PM

Yep and I have heard cascade can be rough when used for bittering, is that true?

 

I wonder if Glacier can be had more economically? Plus it's a dual use hop making it pretty versatile.



#17 Big Nake

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 04:02 PM

Yep and I have heard cascade can be rough when used for bittering, is that true? I wonder if Glacier can be had more economically? Plus it's a dual use hop making it pretty versatile.

I haven't used Cascade early so I can't say. But I could see Glacier early and then a mix of all three hops as late additions (15, 10, 5, etc). It seemed like a strange combination and I would wonder how someone came to use these three hop which appear (to me) to have no connection other than maybe the brewery was able to secure a metric assload of all of them for a low price. The Pale Ale was SRM 8 or 9, 6% and IBUs in the 40s. Very refreshing and easy to drink, for sure. The place (at 7th and Walnut in Bloomington) is Scotty's Brewhouse and the brewery is called Three Wise Men. Not sure why the PLACE isn't called Three Wise Men but whatever. Maybe I'll head over to my LHBS and pick up 5 or 6 hops that I have never used and do something nutty with them. Like make a pale ale. ;)

#18 neddles

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 04:39 PM

I have heard nice things about Glacier and you can add it to my long list of hops to try. It is the featured hop in Surly's Bitter Brewer (sessionable pale ale), a beer I have not had. I know you may be able to get it at Binney's though.

 

We really need to get back to Bloomington sometime. I can clearly recall what your daughter is going through right now, fun times. Good luck to her.



#19 Big Nake

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 05:08 PM

I have heard nice things about Glacier and you can add it to my long list of hops to try. It is the featured hop in Surly's Bitter Brewer (sessionable pale ale), a beer I have not had. I know you may be able to get it at Binney's though. We really need to get back to Bloomington sometime. I can clearly recall what your daughter is going through right now, fun times. Good luck to her.

Thank you my friend. She originally did not like the look of her dorm (in Teter) but she dressed it up and moved everything in and then her roommate (who lives about 3 hrs N. of B-Town) showed up. They met at orientation and have been texting for the last 2 months. The roommate shows up with a fridge, microwave, coffeemaker, 37" flatscreen TV and a futon. They will get along great and have a fun time there. We went to the auditorium for a freshman "induction" ceremony and I have nothing but good stuff to say about the school and town.Okay... that settles it: I'm going to pick up some Glacier and make something with it. Will I use Crystal and Cascade too? Maybe. :D

#20 neddles

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 05:47 PM

Thank you my friend. She originally did not like the look of her dorm (in Teter) but she dressed it up and moved everything in and then her roommate (who lives about 3 hrs N. of B-Town) showed up. They met at orientation and have been texting for the last 2 months. The roommate shows up with a fridge, microwave, coffeemaker, 37" flatscreen TV and a futon. They will get along great and have a fun time there. We went to the auditorium for a freshman "induction" ceremony and I have nothing but good stuff to say about the school and town.Okay... that settles it: I'm going to pick up some Glacier and make something with it. Will I use Crystal and Cascade too? Maybe. :D

Funny, I was in Teter-Boisen. Not that thrilled with it at first, but at the time it was one of the few dorms with AC. Had a great assigned roommate. The place grew on me and I stayed there for soph. year too.

 

I say make a special bitter and feature Glacier in it. I'd be willing to bet a lot of people here have used it and will chime in. My understanding is that it was pretty ubiquitous during the hop shortage. I wasn't brewing back then.




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