29 replies to this topic

[SchwanzBrewer]

I made an Irish Red again as I usually do this time of year because one of my dads friends always requests it for his party.

 

Well my father in law thinks it's a little bland. It was just carbonated and hasn't cleared up totally yet. I was getting plenty of bready and toast malt flavors with a bit of bitterness to back it up. Overall I think it's a very well made beer. I changed the recipe up a little. I usually use roasted barley to get the color, but it's really easy to get the acrid roast to come through too much. So I switched up to midnight wheat. I think it was a good change. The toast flavor is good and the color is pretty red.

 

I'll post a pic when I can get a clear glass.

 

I'm serving some this weekend and I need to transfer to a smaller keg. I'm thinking about using the hop rocket and pushing it through with some english hops to really give a nice earthy hop character and make it a little more interesting. The event is a competition, but I'm not sure my beer will stand out enough to come close to winning. It's a combination judges choice and peoples choice comp. I'm thinking a little hop character in the nose might help. It's a completely quaffable beer.

 

Recipe...92% Maris Otter

6% C-55

2% Midnight Wheat

 

Nugget @ 60, 21 IBU 

EKG @ 20, 5 IBU

 

OG - 1.052

FG - 1.012

14.5 SRM

 

WYeast 1084, Irish Ale Yeast

 

Mine finished a little lower at 1.010. Might be a little too dry if anything, though the esters add some sweetness.

 

Any ideas?

 

[Big Nake]

25 IBUs could be low for this style but it's always the brewer's interpretation. I sometimes divide "red ales" into "Irish" and "American" with Irish being roastier and using a UK strain of yeast and then American which might be more carmelly, less roasty and possibly more hoppy. I prefer an American interpretation mostly because I don't go for roasty flavors in beer. I think the MW is excellent and I think your recipe looks nice although I might like to see more hops so the hop rocket thing might be a good idea.As an aside, I'm going to use this WLP011 I have to make my own red ale. RedX malt with 4 ounces of Thomas Fawcett & Sons Dark crystal #1. That should get it good & red. Then Magnum to bitter (I have some uber-fresh German Magnums that smell unreal) and then late additions of... wait for it... Hallertau Select, French Strisselspalt and Crystal. Jeebus knows what I was thinking with the hops but that's what I'm going for.Cheers and good luck with the beer.

[SchwanzBrewer]

bjcp... 17 - 28 IBU

 

Only thing is that it lacks a little sweetness and there are light esters in the aroma. bjcp doesn't mention esters in the aroma (which I think is idiotic) It says no esters in the flavor. I don't think I've ever had am irish/english beer that didn't have esters of some sort. It's classic to all the damn ale yeasts from over there. 

 

The more i think about it, the more I want to leave it alone. Especially since the judged beer will be to bjcp. 

[Big Nake]

bjcp... 17 - 28 IBU Only thing is that it lacks a little sweetness and there are light esters in the aroma. bjcp doesn't mention esters in the aroma (which I think is idiotic) It says no esters in the flavor. I don't think I've ever had am irish/english beer that didn't have esters of some sort. It's classic to all the damn ale yeasts from over there.  The more i think about it, the more I want to leave it alone. Especially since the judged beer will be to bjcp.

I know the BJCP range is okay but by homebrewing standards, 25 IBU in a red ale might be considered low... even by me the non-hophead. If you decided to make a change to it before it was served, it's possible that you could improve the 'fullness, roundness' of it by back-chloriding it. Boil a little water and add ½ gram of calcium chloride to the water and pour that into the keg. The added chloride can give the beer some perceived sweetness and maybe take any dry edge off of it that it may have. I typically only do this if I feel that there is nothing to lose and everything to gain. I have "back-sweetened", "back-sulfated", "back-chloride", etc. all with good results. Also, I agree on the yeasts... the UK strains tend to be mildly fruity so esters are pretty common unless you ferment lower which would result in a cleaner beer. I typically ferment 1028, 1968, 1099, 1098, etc. in the low 60s.

[StankDelicious]

bjcp... 17 - 28 IBU

 

Only thing is that it lacks a little sweetness and there are light esters in the aroma. bjcp doesn't mention esters in the aroma (which I think is idiotic) It says no esters in the flavor. I don't think I've ever had am irish/english beer that didn't have esters of some sort. It's classic to all the damn ale yeasts from over there. 

 

The more i think about it, the more I want to leave it alone. Especially since the judged beer will be to bjcp. 

 

In my Irish Red I use 8oz of Special B.

[Big Nake]

In my Irish Red I use 8oz of Special B.

Yeah, between the special B, good British Crystal, RedX and even a small amount of dehusked Carafa III, we should be seeing some awesome red beers coming up. BlKtRe posted some and HMC posted some nice red beers in the POST A PICTURE thread. I have a red lager in secondary at the moment and I'll snap a pic of that when I can and this next red ale (with RedX) should be red as well. My go-to RED combo in the past was 8 ounces of C120 plus 8 ounces of Special B along with the pale malts.

Edited by KenLenard, 21 October 2014 - 09:38 AM.

[BarelyBrews]

and even a small amount of dehusked Carafa III,

 

I have  a really nice color in my red on tap , have not made my mind up about it yet. Overly roasty? with the 5 oz of carafa 3 . That's what i seem to be getting. I liked your old CL120/ Spec B combo too ken. Or even i thought chocolate malt for color. Maybe, i am just turning into a beer snob.

[SchwanzBrewer]

I've made this in the past with Special B. I might do that again to add a little complexity. I'm actually liking the malt profile for this beer a lot. I think an american version with some citrusy hops would be damn good.

[HVB]

I've made this in the past with Special B. I might do that again to add a little complexity. I'm actually liking the malt profile for this beer a lot. I think an american version with some citrusy hops would be damn good.

That was my thought when you posted this.  I would like to make what you posted but use some centennials or something like that late.  It may not be to a style but it would be a crowd pleaser I am sure.

[SchwanzBrewer]

That was my thought when you posted this.  I would like to make what you posted but use some centennials or something like that late.  It may not be to a style but it would be a crowd pleaser I am sure.

 

I think the malt profile would lend itself to a slightly bigger beer with a lot of hops really well.

[HVB]

I think the malt profile would lend itself to a slightly bigger beer with a lot of hops really well.

Do you think the 1084 is crucial to the beer?

 

ETA: sorry for the tangent

Edited by drez77, 21 October 2014 - 10:59 AM.

[Poptop]

Due to Brother Ken, I too like the C120/Special B combo and have used it for several color variations and flavor on different beers

[SchwanzBrewer]

Do you think the 1084 is crucial to the beer?

 

ETA: sorry for the tangent

 

It definitely has an identifiable character. I use it in my dry stout and the character is very similar. Mostly I think it's an ester profile. It's pleasant and mild, but it's there for sure. In an Irish Red I'd personally expect it to be there. I think it compliments the toasty/biscuit character in the malts well. Might not be as complimentary in an american hopped up version. So yeah, without it, I'd say it would lack character (so long as you aren't hopping it up).

[StankDelicious]

Yeah, between the special B, good British Crystal, RedX and even a small amount of dehusked Carafa III, we should be seeing some awesome red beers coming up. BlKtRe posted some and HMC posted some nice red beers in the POST A PICTURE thread. I have a red lager in secondary at the moment and I'll snap a pic of that when I can and this next red ale (with RedX) should be red as well. My go-to RED combo in the past was 8 ounces of C120 plus 8 ounces of Special B along with the pale malts.

 

 

Due to Brother Ken, I too like the C120/Special B combo and have used it for several color variations and flavor on different beers

 

I've used the C120/Special B combo as well, but for my taste I like to have some roasted barley in there as well. My goto these days is C60, Special B, Flaked Wheat and a smidge of roasted barley using White Labs 004.

 

Next time I make this, I'll be using Rex-X in place of the pale malt.

[StankDelicious]

I've made this in the past with Special B. I might do that again to add a little complexity. I'm actually liking the malt profile for this beer a lot. I think an american version with some citrusy hops would be damn good.

 

Red-X, C120, Special B with some Amarillo and Citra sounds nice. 1056 or WLP060 maybe?

[positiveContact]

Red-X, C120, Special B with some Amarillo and Citra sounds nice. 1056 or WLP060 maybe?

 

sounds like you are getting into amber territory.

[StankDelicious]

sounds like you are getting into amber territory.

Drop the Special B then.

 

ETA: This is the Murica! version anyways. We do what we want!

Edited by BigBossMan, 21 October 2014 - 12:44 PM.

[positiveContact]

Drop the Special B then.

 

ETA: This is the Murica! version anyways. We do what we want!

 

I don't usually think of irish red as having much in the way of hop character (other than bitterness).  when I hear Amarillo and citra I'm thinking this beer is going to have some hop character or maybe you like wasting those as bittering additions???  just makes me think amber.

[SchwanzBrewer]

Red-X, C120, Special B with some Amarillo and Citra sounds nice. 1056 or WLP060 maybe?

 

By american version I mean just use some 1056 or 1450 and hop the shit out of it. I think the bready toast character will be a little more subtle without the 1084 and earthy hops.

[StankDelicious]

I don't usually think of irish red as having much in the way of hop character (other than bitterness).  when I hear Amarillo and citra I'm thinking this beer is going to have some hop character or maybe you like wasting those as bittering additions???  just makes me think amber.

 

I see what you're saying.

 

By american version I mean just use some 1056 or 1450 and hop the shit out of it. I think the bready toast character will be a little more subtle without the 1084 and earthy hops.

 

Building on what Morty said, what hops would you use for bittering? Personally, I have no issue with using Citra as a bittering hop. I don't think of it as wasteful, if it achieves the desired result.

Edited by BigBossMan, 21 October 2014 - 01:01 PM.